The Enemy of the World episode 6 discussion:
R: <Salamander voice> “Sooo… what ‘chu wan’ me to do, eh?”
Sp: I don’t think in all the science fiction I have ever watched I have ever seen a villain killed by kicking him into the credits.
<laughter>
Sp: Worth the price of admission just for that.
R: Yeah. This story may get a bad rap, but there was a lot of good stuff in it.
H: It doesn’t get a bad rap. It’s seen as an oddball story because of the fact that it’s the only story in the season with no monsters.
M: <Salamander voice> “What do you mean no monsters, eh?”
H: And it’s just not one of my personally favorites. I always felt that… I feel watching it this time it came together a little better. But the first time I saw it I didn’t feel like the ending worked. This time, probably because I knew what to expect, it worked better for me. But again the first time I saw it was in the context of the whole season, and it was completely different from everything that surrounds it.
K: I think this one is another example of works better split up, week by week.
R: Yeah, sometimes you need time to heal between episodes.
H: It doesn’t help that the stories before and after this are huge favorites as well.
R: Well, I liked Astrid a lot.
K: I’m glad she survived.
R: Yeah, me too.
E: Same. I really liked Astrid.
R: And the twist with Kent there at the end… I just kind of went ZOMG what??
H: Yeah. That was, the first time, that made me said, eh?
Sp: Eh?
H: And not in a Salamander kind of way. This time I thought it worked better, because again I knew what to expect. But I still feel that it comes a little out of no where.
K: I think because we hadn’t seen Kent for a while, and it was like… Oh yeah. Him? I think I remember him.
H: He’s the guy who’s plates were being smashed. He was fighting against Salamander the whole time, but only replace him because he knew the whole plan.
K: So the red herring twist guy! Okay. The ketchup fake death guy.
R: They’re not very subtle. It would have been nice if they’d set it up so that… if they either left it a genuine surprise, or build up to it a little bit more clearly. Because the whole time the Doctor is like “I don’t like you. I think you’re a liar.” And there’s no real evidence for it, except that he’s kind of blood thirsty. Which is understandable, given the context. I would have liked it if the Doctor had come around to his side, and then Kent showed his evil face.
H: He kind of did.
K: The Doctor was never going to consent to killing Salamander though.
Sp: At a meta level, I think my way of expressing where you’re going is that now that we’ve seen the whole story, the plot basically feels like one giant Jenga tower in a dark room. And the Doctor crept in, found one block, and said “oh dear. I wonder what this does” and then pulled it. And it all fell over. The end.
H: Again, I think having seen this before, it holds up a little better than that, and builds up a little better than that. But you may have to see it a second time to really get all that, if you see what I mean.
Sp: I do, but that doesn’t speak well of the story, because I shouldn’t have to watch it multiple times to get it.
R: Memento it ain’t.
H: That’s one of the reasons I’ve been saying over the past few weeks that this wasn’t one of my favorite stories. I just didn’t want to explicate on why…
Sp: You didn’t want to prejudice us against the story.
H: Exactly.
E: It certainly went out with bang.
<groans>
P: Hey, that was awful.
<general laughter>
P: Why would you do that?
E: I was waiting to say that, you know.
P: I still think he got what he was entitled to, you know. <he got thrown into the titles>
H: Anyway… Spoo, you were saying.
Sp: So, by the end of it the Doctor and companions just sort of stumbled into the situation and investigated it to death. Which is another way of saying what I meant with my Jenga analogy earlier. They didn’t step in to boldly right a wrong. They just kind of got everybody to turn on everybody else and tried to help the good guys be the first to turn on the bad guys.
H: But… that’s not unusual for this show, is it?
Sp: I just stuck out a lot this time. Done less gracefully than other stories.
K: Did the people in the cave get rescued?
H: Yes. They were going to rescue them when the Doctor slipped away.
K: So we don’t know for sure that they were rescued!
H: Technically no.
K: Lame. Although the two horny kids survived, so that was okay.
H: You mean you wanted this episode to be longer?
K: No. The kids survived. Just tracking the body count. The two characters that you kind of cared about lived.
H: So, little technical factoid – Barry Letts had wanted to do a lot more of the Doctor meets Salamander in this story. So he researched the way it was supposedly done. And spent all this time on it, shot all this footage for it, and it turned out that he was using an antiquated way that didn’t really work. Another director told him what he was doing wrong, but by that time he only had time for the one scene. Which is one of the reasons why the Doctor and Salamander only come face to face at the very end.
Sp: So since we missed seeing the effect, because recon, how did they do it.
H: We at least saw the telesnaps. But I don’t recall the exact method. I’d have to look it up. Anyway, anything thoughts on the Web of Fear trailer?
P: I liked it for what it was.
H: I love the bit with Troughton saying “if your mummies and daddies are scared hold their hand.”
P: So, with the exception of the explosions and the face to face, a lot of the special effects we have already seen in this story. So I think it was kind of a let down for this episode, because there was kind of only one surprise.
K: Yeah, we got the helicopter and hovercraft in the first episode, and then never seen again.
H: Apparently the final sucked out the TARDIS effect was really, really awesome. But how should we know. Unless of course the stupid sourceless rumors are true, and Enemy of the World has been found. Believe me, no one would like that more than me, but it’s unlikely. So, are we ready for final thoughts?
E: <two thumbs up> I liked it. I wasn’t sure about the story as a whole, but I think the ending really did it for me. I didn’t really have high hopes for the ending. The story itself was intriguing, but it was worried the ending wouldn’t hold up. But it did, and I was pleasantly surprised.
P: It was credible what happened to him.
K: Why do you make me type these things? Moving on.
A: I liked the story as a whole. Lot of action. Good characters. Liked the food taster. The chef. There were a couple of weeks where “When do we get to see the Doctor as Salamander?” There were a couple of curve balls, like the underground people and the thing with Kent at the end. It just seemed like there was a lot packed into the story.
K: I agree.
P: I think the story arc took a long time to mature. And I think we were impatient about it earlier. I think that was an aspect of the writing the suffered. But overall the story was still better for it, in that there were really strong characters, there was a lot of motivation for different people, and it was mutating during the story. I agree with the Historian in that probably the second viewing will have a different impact for that reason. Although we didn’t see him physically acting, I think Troughton did a great job both with the vocalization and conveying the difference between the characters. It wasn’t hard to differentiate between them.
K: The Doctor’s version of Salamander didn’t go “eh?” all the time. It was that simple.
Cz: I liked the ending a lot, actually. I’ve always wanted to get sucked into credits.
H: Well, perhaps some day you’ll have the opportunity.
Cz: Yeah.
H: O… kay.
Sp: <Salamander voice> It’s much bigger outside that it is insiiiiiide…….
H: Spoo, it’s your turn. Final thought?
Sp: Eh?
K: That’s it?
P: Where’s the thought?
Sp: No, I said it before. Yes, it’s typical for Our Heroes to wander into a situation, uncover a plot, and turn people against one another. But for some reason it just didn’t work for this story for me. Some of the little intrigues and character moments were interesting. And obviously the whole Troughton Actor Studio thing was really entertaining.
R: The One Doctors.
<laughter>
Sp: Well put. And Jamie had a good moment there a few episodes ago in “Action Jamie non-kilt mode.” But… I don’t know. It’s just kind of there. There’s some interesting pieces to it, but it doesn’t hang together well, and the whole underground people making natural disasters thing came in late, and at a weird angle.
R: It’s amazing just to hear that said at all, about anything, ever.
H: You know one of the things that might bug me about that plot is that they never, ever explain how they create the natural disasters, how that technology developed. Because it’s technology the people on the surface don’t believe could exist because none of them think Salamander’s really doing it. It’s just a plot point that doesn’t really have an explanation. Maybe that’s part of it – I don’t know.
K: I know why. It’s a spy movie parody, right? Sort of?
H: Pastiche.
K: Sure. That thing. And, in spy movies there’s always a super villain…
R: Dr. Eh?
K: Yeah. And the super villain always has some crazy ass impossible trick up his sleeve. Like sharks with laser beams and volcanoes.
H: But they take the time to explain the techno-babble in spy movies.
R: Blah blah blah lamp shade Mr. Bond.
H: Exactly.
K: But there wasn’t a moment with the Doctor strapped to a chair with a laser aimed at him.
H: And you thought that was a good thing?
K: No, I wanted that too. That would have been an awesome cliffhanger! And it would have actually fit this stupid story. Bummer they didn’t actually get the split screen working. I bet something like that was in the original script! Or… maybe not.
H: So, Spoo. You got any more?
Sp: <looks confused> Salamander’s right hand man… Bruce. Props to anybody who could roll his Rs. And boy, Bruce could roll him some Rs.
H: Ronelyn, final thoughts?
R: <nerd voice> I think the whole think was a comment on the futility of patriarchal societies because Astrid is the only who really does anything, or saves anyone. And when she gets down into the underground cave everyone is overwhelmed by her raw female sexuality.
<stunned silence>
Sp: <stoner voice> I think the whole thing was a comment on the futility of patriarchal societies because… like… all the men are just like dur dur I’m going to rule the world dur dur and then they blow up and die.
R: <nerd voice> I’m still not dating you after class.
Sp: <stoner voice> But I’m like overwhelmed by your raw female sexuality.
K: Oh boy. Are you done Ronelyn?
R: <quietly> Yeah.
K: So, I think I covered most of what I had to say. I overall agree with Altair’s assessment. I wish I’d kept track of who Kent was a bit better. And it did feel like it was broken up into three parts, which was okay… the spy chasey bit at the start, the Jamie and Victoria undercover part, and then the underground betrayal double blind betrayal again part. Clearly the story could have been improved by some tightening up. But I actually like this one. Maybe just to spite the Historian, I’m not sure. 😛
H: There are all kind of great bits in this story. I do not feel that they necessarily fit together properly. And really that’s probably the biggest problem I have with the story. That being said, I did enjoy it more this time than I did the last time I saw it, and even so-so Troughton is really great Doctor Who. Next up is one of my favorite stories, so hopefully you guys will enjoy that too.
Sp: Oh mom! Yeti again? We had Yeti last month!
Cz: Is there gonna be snow?
H: No.
Cz: It’s not a Yeti if there isn’t snow.
